Multicultural Australia If all Cultures and Religions are equal what's the big deal with Female Genital Mutilation ?

Genital mutilation guidelines to help treat victims

Melissa Davey
Health Reporter
SMH
November 24, 2012



THOUSANDS of victims of genital mutilation live in NSW and experts say doctors are untrained in how to treat them, with many suffering from childbirth complications as a result of their condition.

With an increased intake of refugees from countries in Africa, the Middle East and south-east Asia, more women with genital mutilation are living in Australia, with most in NSW. 

It has prompted the state Health Department to develop the first guidelines for clinicians treating women affected by the barbaric procedure, which involves partial or total 
removal of the genitalia.

"We didn't want to be in that situation ever again."

An obstetrician specialising in the care of women with genital mutilation, Greg Jenkins, said it was often not identified by doctors until women were admitted to hospital in 
labour.
''That's really too late and it needs to be recognised earlier in their pregnancy so the opportunity for counselling and management is there,'' Dr Jenkins said. ''The difficulty is, in 
the country where they come from, genital mutilation is common so midwives there assume women have had it done and know what to do.''



Dr Jenkins works at Auburn Hospital, the only hospital with dedicated guidelines on how to care for mutilation victims. His program requires at least one senior midwife 
experienced in female genital mutilation and childbirth to be on hand at every shift. Women are assigned a midwife who they see exclusively throughout their pregnancy, with an interpreter available for those with little English.

''What prompted our guidelines was a 16-year-old girl who came into hospital in labour in 1993,'' Dr Jenkins said.
''She had quite a severe form of genital mutilation and the staff, who had never seen a case before, didn't know how to deal with it. She ended up with a nasty tear, and when 
the operating theatre consultant came in they didn't know what to do about it. We didn't want to be in that situation ever again.''



Dr Jenkins said he had not been consulted about the development of the clinical guidelines but said he supported anything that would help improve treatment. While they will not 
be mandatory, a NSW Health spokeswoman said hospitals would require ''very sound reasons'' for not implementing them.

Without specialised care, women with genital mutilation are at higher risk of birth complications, including foetal distress, hemorrhage and tearing.
One woman, who did not want to be identified, said hospital staff were uncertain of what to do when she was in labour with her second child and they saw her vagina had been 
almost closed through mutilation.

''[So] they cut [me],'' she said.
''But they didn't stitch the incision. After [I went home], I felt some of my genital tissue was sticking out and that the area was still opened wide.''
She went to see a doctor, who did nothing. ''So I lived with that condition until I had my third child,'' she said.
''The baby was big and during that labour the incision was enlarged more and I had complications. I was bleeding for 15 minutes and the midwife was anxious; she didn't realise what was happening to me.''

The draft guidelines will be released next month, when they will be considered by Local Health Districts before being implemented in early to mid-2013.

"FGM Parties": Cutters Flown in to UK for Clitorectomies

Sydney's Occupied Territories:Sheik Shabbir Mohammedbhai Vaziri and Helen Magennis, charged with Female Genital Mutilation

Sydney's Occupied Territories erupt with bucket loads of Taqiya and Harmony Day Spin

Islam: The "Religion" of Choice of the Savage the Sociopath and the Sexual Deviant

KOSOVO PRIME MINISTER OWNS HAREM WITH 52 SLAVES

"Most of the people who arrive here are older, very few are younger. Many of them are foreign diplomats, including officers from EULEX and KFOR. The girls are not allowed to say "No". One of the girls called Dolores from Colombia protested the conditions during our lunch time in the cafeteria. She was shot dead by Thaci's bodyguards" says the Ukrainian witness, who went by her initials N.M."

"According to her, the building has several VIP areas where Thaci and his friends have orgys."

Full Story HERE

From Sydney's Occupied Territories: Sheik and a Nurse charged over Female Genital Mutilation

Sheik charged over female mutilation

Mark Morri, Crime Editor 
The Daily Telegraph
September 13, 2012 2:40PM

A SHEIK and retired nurse have been charged in relation to the genital mutilation of two young girls in Sydney.

Police arrested the Sheik, 56, from Auburn and the 68-year-old nurse earlier today.

The children’s parents were charged last Friday with two counts of female mutilation.

NSW Police Force’s Sex Crimes Squad began investigating the allegations earlier this year and set up Strike Force Longfield and have been been working closely with NSW Health and the Department of Family and Community Services.

Police will allege the two girls had the procedure, which is also known as female circumcision, performed on them in NSW when they were aged six and seven.

Female genital mutilation is illegal in NSW, with it also an offence to take a NSW resident overseas to have the procedure performed.

The 56-year-old man was arrested earlier today and has been charged with two counts of accessory after the fact of female genital mutilation; 

and hindering investigation of serious indictable offence. He was refused bail to face Burwood Local Court today.

Also arrested today was a 68-year-old woman who has been charged with two counts of prohibition of female genital mutilation.

Police will allege the woman performed the procedure on the two girls.

She has been granted conditional bail to face Campbelltown Local Court on Wednesday 3 October 2012.

A 42-year-old man and a 35-year-old woman were arrested on Friday 7 September and charged with two counts each of female genital mutilation. 

They were granted bail to appear at Parramatta Local Court on 26 September 2012.

Investigations by Strike Force Longfield are continuing, and police are also appealing for anyone with information about female genital mutilation to come forward.

The mutilation is unlikely to be an isolated case, NSW Family and Community Services and Minister Pru Goward says.

Ms Goward told reporters the investigation was triggered by an anonymous tip-off to her office, and she understood it to be the first time in NSW 
someone has been charged with female genital mutilation.

She would not say if the circumcision of the two girls was for cultural or religious reasons, but added it was "unlikely'' to be an isolated incident.

"That's why the rules were changed in 1994, because I believe that the state was aware that this was a distinct possibility,'' Ms Goward told 
reporters at NSW parliament.

"It is disappointing in a way that it has taken this long for there to be a case where there was sufficient evidence collected to be able to press charges and make arrests.''

Ms Goward said female genital mutilation was an "abhorrent practice'' and "a form of child abuse''.

"It is illegal, and whilst there might be cultural practices acceptable to some communities in NSW it remains the case that it is illegal and that the full force of the law will be brought to bear,'' Ms Goward said.

She would not reveal where the two girls were being cared for, or who was caring for them, but said ``they are safe, and not at risk of further harm''.

"My department have been involved in this all the way along and we've certainly made all the necessary arrangements we believe are in order to ensure these children are safe,'' she said.


Genital mutilation not tolerated: Goward

By Isabel Hayes and Adam Bennett 
Daily Telegraph
September 13, 2012 6:26PM

THE NSW government has warned that female genital mutilation will not be tolerated, after a man charged over the circumcision of two young girls appeared in a Sydney court.

Shabbir Vaziri, 56, appeared before Burwood Local Court on Thursday charged with two counts of being an accessory after the genital mutilation of the girls, who were aged six and seven at the time.

He is one of four people charged over the alleged female circumcision, which occurred in an unspecified location in NSW in the past 18 months.

The two young girls were unlikely to be isolated cases, NSW Family and Community Services and Minister Pru Goward told reporters.

Ms Goward said the investigation leading to the charges was triggered by an anonymous tip-off to her office.

It is understood to be the first time someone has been charged with female genital mutilation in NSW.

Ms Goward would not say if the circumcisions were for cultural or religious reasons, but she added the case was "unlikely" to be an isolated incident.

She described female genital mutilation as an "abhorrent practice" and a form of child abuse.

"It is illegal, and whilst there might be cultural practices acceptable to some communities in NSW, it remains the case that it is illegal and that the full force of the law will be brought to bear," Ms Goward said.

A 68-year-old woman was charged on Thursday with carrying out the procedure and will face Campbelltown Local Court on October 3.

A 42-year-old man and a 35-year-old woman were arrested last Friday and each charged with two counts of female genital mutilation.

They were granted bail to appear in Parramatta Local Court on September 26.

The court heard Vaziri, from Auburn, had no prior convictions and had close ties to the community.

"The defendant has no previous record and is a law-abiding citizen," his lawyer, Hussein Karimjae, told the court.

Vaziri's bail application was opposed by the police prosecutor, who said he posed a flight risk.

The court heard Vaziri held an Indian passport and was about to fly to India when he was arrested.

Magistrate Christopher Longley noted that if convicted, Vaziri would probably be jailed.

But he granted bail under "stringent" conditions, including a $20,000 bond.

"To the overwhelming majority of citizens, this is a most serious set of circumstances," the magistrate said.

Ms Goward would not reveal where the two girls were or who was caring for them, but said "they are safe, and not at risk of further harm".

Sharia Law : Child Sex Slaves all the Rage in Liberated Progress "Arabed Springed "Egypt

‘Summer Brides’: Under-age daughters sold as ‘sex-slaves’ in Egypt, report claims


By AL ARABIYA
Sunday, 15 July 2012 

Wealthy Arab tourists from Gulf countries are paying money to purchase under-age Egyptian girls as “summer-brides”, claims a new report on human trafficking released by the U.S. State Department.

The marriages are not legally binding and end when the men return to their home countries.


According to the report “Trafficking in Persons”, often times these temporary marriages are facilitated by the girls’ parents who profit from the transaction.
According to Britain’s The Daily Mail, the wealthy tourists pay an amount to poor families through intermediaries, ranging from anywhere between $495 and $4,950.The young victims, some under the age of 18, are then forced to serve as sex slaves as well as servants to their “husbands.” 


Egypt has laws in place that aim to combat human trafficking which prevent foreigners from marrying an Egyptian woman if there is more than ten years age difference, but marriage brokers have found a way around that by forging birth certificates to make the girls appear older and the men younger. 


These contracts also eliminate any potential problems with hotels and land lords who may demand to see proof of marriage before allowing a couple to stay in a room together, since pre-marital sex is prohibited in Islam.


In many cases, the family agrees to marry their daughter without her consent, but often the girls are willing participants as they see it as the only way to help provide for their families.


In some cases the men take the Egyptian girls back to their home country to work as maids for their first wives. But even the girls who stay in Egypt do not fare much better since they often become ostracized by society and find it difficult to re-marry in the traditional way, particularly if the “summer marriage” resulted in a child. 


Many of the young women end up in a cycle of temporary marriages with Gulf tourists, and others are targeted by Egyptian men who marry them in order to force them into prostitution.


Many abandon the child out of shame, either to orphanages or leaving them to join the hundreds of thousands of street children that already exist in Egypt.


Arab Spring :Egyptian Sex Slave Marriage,the woman said "I enslave myself to you,"

Dr. Hoda Badran, who chairs the NGO Alliance for Arab Women, explained to the Sunday Independent that poverty is the main factor behind this phenomenon.


“If those families are in such a need to sell their daughters you can imagine how poor they are. Many times, the girl does not know she is marrying the husband just for the short term. She is young, she accepts what her family tells her, she knows the man is going to help them. If the girl is very poor, sometimes it is the only way out to help the family survive,” she told the newspaper.


The report by the State department said Egypt is making significant efforts to eliminate human trafficking, but due to the political unrest in the country over the past year, the government is unable to provide law enforcement and prosecution data on those efforts.


Furthermore, it said Egypt is continuing to develop strategies to implement a comprehensive action plan to address all aspects on trafficking.


In 2009, a court in Egypt’s second largest city Alexandria jailed two registrars for conducting temporary marriages of hundreds of underage girls, however NGOs say that this is only the tip of the iceberg, and that more needs to be done to implement existing laws.


The Muslim "Prophet", Mass Murderer, Slave Trader and Paedophile, Mohammed excelled at Paedophilia and Sex Slave Trading the Anti Christ Anti God if you like.
No wonder his modern day followers replicate with immunity his vile filthy base lifestyle and values and the constant never ending support and apologetics they receive from the Left / Green Progressive Beautiful People Industry.

Arab Spring :Egyptian Sex Slave Marriage,the woman said "I enslave myself to you,"

Egypt's First "Sex-Slave" Marriage


by Raymond Ibrahim
Gatestone Institute 
July 5, 2012


What is being dubbed as Egypt's "first sex-slave marriage" took place mere days after the Muslim Brotherhood's Muhammad Morsi was made president.


Last Monday, on the Egyptian TV show Al Haqiqa ("the Truth"), journalist Wael al-Ibrashi began the program by airing a video-clip of a man, Abd al-Rauf Awn, "marrying" his "slave." Before making the woman, who had a non-Egyptian accent, repeat the Koran's Surat al-Ikhlas after him, instead of saying the customary "I marry
myself to you," the woman said "I enslave myself to you," and kissed him in front of an applauding audience.


Sheikh Awn telling his concubine-bride what to say during their "nuptial vows," which included her "enslavement" to the self-proclaimed Sharia expert.

Then, even though she was wearing a hijab, her owner-husband declared her forbidden from such trappings, commanding her to be stripped of them, so as "not to break Allah's laws." She took her veil
and abaya off, revealing, certainly by Muslim standards, a promiscuous red dress (all the other women present were veiled). The man claps for her as the video-clip (which can be viewed here) ends.
The owner-husband, Abd al-Rauf Awn, then appeared on the show, identifying himself as an Islamic scholar and expert at Islamic jurisprudence who studied at Al Azhar. He gave several Islamic explanations to justify his "marriage," from Islamic prophet Muhammad's "sunna" or practice of "marrying" enslaved captive women, to Koran 4:3, which commands Muslim men to "Marry such women as seem good to you, two and three and four… or what your right hands possess."
For all practical purposes, and to avoid euphemisms, "what your right hands possess"—also known in Arabic as a melk al-yamin—is, according to Islamic doctrine and history, simply a sex-slave. Linguistic evidence further suggests that she is seen more as a possession than a human.


Even stripping the sex-slave of her hijab, the way Awn commanded his concubine-wife, has precedent. According to Islamic jurisprudence, whereas the free (Muslim) woman is mandated to be veiled behind a hijab, sex-slaves are mandated only to be covered from the navel to the knees—with everything else exposed. During the program Awn even explained how Caliph Omar, one of the first "righteous caliphs," used to strip sex-slaves of their garments, whenever he saw them overly dressed in the marketplace.


Awn further explained that sex-slave marriage is ideal for today's Egyptian society. He based his position on ijtihad, a recognized form of jurisprudence, whereby a Muslim scholar comes up with a new idea—one that is still rooted in the Koran and example of Muhammad—yet one that better fits the circumstances of contemporary society.


He argued that, when it comes to marriage, "we Muslims have overly complicated things," so that men are often forced to be single throughout their prime, finally getting married between the ages of 30-40 (when they might be expected to have a sufficient income to open a household). Similarly, many Egyptian women do not want to wear the hijab in public.
The solution, according to Awn, is to reinstitute sex-slavery—allowing men to marry and copulate much earlier in life, and women who want to dress freely to do so, as technically they are sex-slaves and mandated to go about loosely attired, anyway. 

"Who said sex-slavery is over?  What—because the UN said so?"

The other guest on the show, Dr. Abdullah al-Naggar, a professor of Islamic jurisprudence at Al Azhar, fiercely attacked Awn for reviving this practice, calling on him and his slave-wife to "repent" and stop dishonoring Islam, arguing that "there is no longer sex-slavery"—to which Awn responded by sarcastically asking, "Who said sex-slavery is over? What—because the UN said so?"


In many ways, this exchange between Awn, who advocates sex-slave marriage, and the Al Azhar professor symbolizes the clash between today's "Islamists" and "moderate Muslims." For long, Al Azhar has been primarily engaged in the delicate balancing act of affirming Islam while still advocating modernity according to Western standards, whereas the Islamists—from the Muslim Brotherhood to the Salafis—bred with contempt and disrespect for the West, are only too eager to revive distinctly Islamic practices that defy Western sensibilities.


While this may be the first sex-slave marriage to take place in Egypt's recent history, it is certainly not the first call to revive the practice. Earlier, Egyptian Sheikh Huwaini, lamenting that the "good old days" of Islam are over, declared that, in an ideal Muslim society, "when I want a sex-slave [I should be able to go]to the market and pick whichever female I desire and buy her." Likewise, a Kuwaiti female politician advocated for reviving the institute of sex-slavery, suggesting that Muslims should bring female
captives of war—specifically Russian women from the Chechnya war —and sell them to Muslim men in the markets of Kuwait.

And so the "Arab Spring" continues to blossom.

Raymond Ibrahim is a Shillman Fellow at the David Horowitz Freedom Center and an Associate Fellow at the Middle East Forum.

And this from  THE SHEIK AT WINDS OF JIHAD 

Salafists Demand Legalization of Sex-Slave Marriages

Pious Muslim “Justice Fighter” Charged with bashing his estranged wife "black and blue" at her Yagoona home.

Youth leader ACCUSED of bashing his estranged wife

Fadi Abdul-Rahman seen here in happier times,plotting the demise of Australia with then Australian Prime Minister, Lu Kewen / Kevin 07 “I have never been a Socialist” Rudd, at the Grand Socialist Elites and Celebrity 2020 Summit / Gab fest in 2008.

" ....the Government here is better than our Sharia Law for women"

From Sydney's Occupied Territories :Divorce the Sharia Law way

Brenden Hills Court Reporter
The Sunday Telegraph
July 08, 2012 12:00AM


ANTI-CRIME crusader Fadi Abdul-Rahman has been accused of bashing his estranged wife "black and blue" at her Yagoona home.
Muslim leader Abdul-Rahman, who featured at Kevin Rudd's 2020 Summit in 2008 and has been a fighter for justice in western Sydney, was charged with assaulting his wife on February 6.
Despite being the alleged victim, Abdul-Rahman's wife is now wedged between her religion, her husband and the NSW legal system after a Sydney court threatened to arrest her if she refused to give evidence when her husband's case next appears in court.
The ex-boxer screamed "f ... ... let me in", ripped a door security screen, forced his way into the house, and bashed his wife of 16 years, leaving her with two black eyes, court documents said.
Abdul-Rahman is charged with assault occasioning bodily harm, aggravated break and enter and home invasion, and will face a committal hearing next month.
Lawyer Brett Galloway said Abdul-Rahman will defend the matter and has no case to answer
Abdul-Rahman, 35, became a prominent figure for his work in steering Lebanese youth away from a life of crime, and was the subject of SBS and ABC TV documentaries.
Court documents said on the night of the alleged assault, Mrs Abdul-Rahman spoke to police. An officer asked her "who did this to you?" and she replied: "My husband."
The officer then told her: "I cannot help you without the truth in what happened".
Mrs Abdul-Rahman has refused to make a formal statement after speaking to her mosque's sheik and to family members, court documents said. Police have made several further unsuccessful approaches to Mrs Abdul-Rahman.
In Burwood Local Court on June 28, magistrate Michael Connell ordered that if Mrs Abdul-Rahman does not appear in court on July 8 he "may consider" issuing an arrest warrant.
Court documents said police, called to the house by neighbours, found Mrs Abdul-Rahman with bruised eyes.
Police allege Abdul-Rahman went into a "rage" when his wife told him to "go away", court documents said.
An officer at the house viewed a mobile phone which received a text message that said: "It's OK to answer your phone. Make sure (Mrs Abdul-Rahman) is not talking", court documents said.
The matter will return to court on August 6.

But he's such a GOOOD Boy,is our Fadi, he neva dun nuffen to no body,You tell em Fadi, you tell em Fadi, say it ain't so Fadi, say it ain't so.
_______________________________



Egyptian Cleric Sa'd Arafat: Islam Permits Wife Beating Only When She Refuses to Have Sex with Her Husband
Al-Rahma TV (Egypt) - February 4, 2010 - 03:32

What's to prevent this when the Qur'an tells men to beat their wives? 

"Men are the maintainers of women because Allah has made some of them to excel others and because they spend out of their property; the good women are therefore obedient, guarding the unseen as Allah has guarded; and (as to) those on whose part you fear desertion, admonish them, and leave them alone in the sleeping-places and beat them" (Sura 4:34). At least this guy is in danger of prosecution (we'll see about that), but how many other cases like this have gone unreported and unnoticed?"  Full story  here 

      Saudi TV Presenter Rania -al- Baz

"Rania Al Baz might be a prominent Saudi but is far from liked by Saudis. She used to work as a presenter on the Saudi national channel. In April 2004 she was seriously beaten up by her husband. After a photo of the aftermath was published in local media, sympathy came pouring in. Her hospital bill was taken care of by a member of the royal family. Her husband was duly punished and she was granted custody of her two sons. She also has a daughter from a previous marriage. There were people who raised doubts about why her husband got that angry in the first place. There were even rumors that she was on the phone flirting with another man when her husband came in. Lucky for Rania, the husband lost a lot of his credibility when he shot at his sister in Egypt and then kidnapped her in Lebanon for singing."  More 

According to the Egyptian cleric /holy man the Koran says to beat your wife if need be

What does a Muslim man do, obey the Koran or behave like a civilized human being?

Technorati Tags: Fadi Abdul-Rahman,Islamic Sociopaths Inc.,Muslim,Islam,Wife Bashing,Kevin Rudd,Lu Kewen,Kevin 07,ALP

From Sydney's Occupied Territories :Divorce the Sharia Law way

Divorce 2012 in Sydney's Occupied Territories.  

To think that soverign Australian territory is now Occupied by these very dangerous Misogynist's freaks is appalling.

How were they able to suceed in their illegal colonization / occupation of Australian Soverign Territory?


Read on............

Alan Jones Ruddock interview

Paul Keating, ALP Fedmember for Lakemba,State ALP,

Philip Ruddock

MINISTER FOR IMMIGRATION AND

MULTICULTURAL AFFAIRS

Interview with Alan Jones, 2UE   (Alan Jones is now at 2GB.com or 873AM Sydney )

ALAN JONES: This boat people issue doesn't go away. The Prime Minister yesterday, in launching his policy, made the simple point that the Government will decide who comes into Australia and on what terms. It's as simple as that, and it is simple. How many times have I made the point that if you're going to determine who comes into your home and on what terms, surely we as a nation have that entitlement in relation to our national home.

But now we have the spectacle after last week and an Indonesian fishing boat sinking and 350 so-called asylum seekers dying, we've got the spectacle of three Indonesian warships searching for a fishing boat allegedly hijacked by Iraqi asylum seekers and believed to be heading to Australia.

Now, the search was under way since last Thursday, the day after it was reportedly seized by 170 asylum seekers. But now it has been found drifting off the Indonesian island of Sumbawa and the boat people have been taken by smaller boats to the village of Sangyang which is an hour's sail away. It's said that the boat was hijacked by a group of Iraqi refugees who want to go to Australia. So the debate goes on.

As one editorial wrote at the weekend, "When Australians awoke last week to the image of three little girls staring from almost every newspaper front page, many felt a surge of sorrow and a huge pang of guilt. Suddenly, protecting our borders from asylum seekers seemed flint-hearted. What nation could be so stony as to turn away the sweet innocence? Surely not the land of a fair go."

But it went on. "A mourning Muslim community was quick to blame the Government. After all, it was argued the girls would never have been on board that leaking rust bucket had it not been for our law designed to ensure those who seek refugee status really are refugees."

It said, "The Muslim community, so deeply touched by tragedy, could easily be forgiven for reacting in anger." And then it said, "The truth is somewhat different." It said, "It should be remembered that those who choose Australia as a destination do so not because they've suddenly become imbued with Aussie fervour, it's because the people-smuggling industry sees us as an easy target. The softer we get, the more they will come."

And it's on again. We woke yesterday to headlines which cried, "Mutiny on the Ocean - Vessels Head for Australia." And then of course in the middle of all this last week, we've got Sheik Taj el-Din Al Hilaly,the alleged spiritual leader of Australia's 300,000 Muslims, accusing John Howard and government policy of having "opened the gates to death" to the asylum seekers who drowned off Indonesia.

And that has led to a flood of comments, emails and faxes from you to me about the Sheik, such that it's time we spoke to the Immigration Minister about what this bloke is saying, who he is and how long he can go on saying it. And Philip Ruddock is on the line.

Minister, good morning.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Morning, Alan.

ALAN JONES: What about this mutiny on the ocean? What is the update, and what do you know on that?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, no more than the reports. I mean, obviously while we're in touch with the Indonesian authorities, they don't brief us on all of these developments. But I'm pleased that we haven't seen a further loss of life because I think the events of last week were tragic and one wouldn't want to see those sorts of things happening again.

And as far as I'm concerned, if we were to relax our approach and encourage more people to think that they should come this way, we would only be exposing more children to a possible death in the same way that these children have died.

ALAN JONES: There is talk today that two Indonesian police officers have been arrested over the fishing boat that sank on October 19 with only 44 of its passengers surviving. Can you confirm that?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: I can't, but it's a matter for the Indonesian authorities to, of course, progress.

They've been obviously very concerned about many of the claims that have been made - I would be - and they've sought to deal with it.

And our view all along was that it was a matter for the Indonesians to handle. It's within their boundaries,they're a sovereign nation and they've got responsibility in relation to any complaints that are made about their law enforcement officers.

ALAN JONES: There's talk of 3,000 more boat people expected to head for Australia in the next few weeks and the Indonesian Government saying there are 4,000 illegal immigrants waiting to sail to Australia. Is that consistent with your intelligence?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Not quite. I mean, the sorts of numbers that we've known to be in the hands of smugglers - that is, we've identified particular smugglers who might be planning to bring boats to Australia - don't suggest the numbers are immediately as high as that. But the reports of up to 4,000 in Indonesia and possibly another 4,000 in Malaysia are very real.

ALAN JONES: Is there a need to re-examine the quotas on refugees who are found to be genuine? We allow in about 12,000 a year.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, I mean, Mr Beazley's not arguing that we should and the reason he's not is that there is a very heavy cost. And it's one of the draw factors, of course. I mean, for us it's $30 million per thousand on the forward estimates. So I mean, you can decide that you're going to spend that money on additional refugees being resettled in Australia, but I look at what's happening at the moment in Pakistan, for instance, and I think to myself, well, what would $30 million do in terms of looking after millions of people who are in dire straits.

And I think that certainly the approach being taken by the international community at this stage is that an evacuation of modest numbers of people from Pakistan is not going to deal with the very much larger crisis that Pakistan faces. And I think it has to be seen in that context.

And there's no amount of people that we could take that would limit, I think, the groups of people with money to travel and still vulnerable to the blandishments of smugglers.

ALAN JONES: Okay. Well, down to the thing that has concerned my listeners - and I have been inundated and I suppose you have as well. But they're asking me how much longer that Australians have to cop the kind of stuff that this Sheik Taj el-Din Al Hilaly went on with last week arguing that you and the Prime Minister and government policy had "opened the gates of death."

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well look, I wasn't very impressed with the comments, as you can imagine, and I'd seen the Sheik several hours before he made them and didn't make them to my face.

I said - look, one of the things in your introduction I'd just pick up. I think it's unfair to say that all Muslims take the view that the government policy in this area is wrong. Many Muslims I know very strongly support the approach that we take because they believe we're a…

ALAN JONES: But this bloke calls himself the spiritual leader.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Yeah well, he does that but his position is not as sound as that and he's been - essentially, I think there are very significant splits within the Islamic community.

ALAN JONES: Well, Alan Ramsey who's been around Canberra longer than you have - and that's saying something…

PHILIP RUDDOCK: I saw Alan…

ALAN JONES: Well, he wrote at the weekend - and I just want to take you through some of this because my listeners want some answers - that 11 years ago, as Opposition spokesman on immigration, you pursued questions never answered as to why the Hawke Labor Government granted this bloke, Al Hilaly, permanent residency in 1990, that eight years earlier, he said, the Sheik had arrived in Sydney from Egypt under the Australian Federation of Islamic Councils on a three-month visa and his family never left.

Now there were several convictions, intellectual convictions against this bloke and many want to know how he still remains in the light of saying the things he said.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, I mean, Alan Ramsey's story went through it and I think there were some other stories at the same time, that related what happened. I mean, this…

ALAN JONES: He was accused of inciting racial hatred.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Yes, and Chris Hurford, who was the former Minister, determined that in character terms he should not remain in Australia.

ALAN JONES: That's right.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: And he issued a deportation order.

ALAN JONES: That's in 1986.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: And that was overturned because there were representations made by essentially the Lebanese Muslim Association in Sydney to the Members of Parliament - I think Leo McLeay was one and Paul Keating was another.

ALAN JONES: Alan Ramsey said that Hilaly had been supported by strong New South Wales and federal ALP lobbying and survived.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, as I understand it, there was very strong lobbying, and I spoke to Robert Ray at the time. He made the decisions that he would be able to continue to remain here on a temporary basis.

They were renewed, as I understand it, for a number of years, and Ray I think was a bit nervous that there may be a change in an election. It didn't happen. There was a Labor Government was returned and Hilaly was given permanent residency.

And once he was granted permanent residency, provided he remained in Australia, he was eligible for citizenship.

ALAN JONES: Let's go back a bit, just go back a bit, because…

PHILIP RUDDOCK: …while Gerry Hand was Minister…

ALAN JONES: Let's go back a bit though before we get to Gerry Hand because you're going fairly quickly but my listeners would want us to go a bit more slowly.

In October 1998, you demanded his visa be withdrawn after, as Ramsey rightly reports, a series of virulent anti-Semitic comments were attributed to a speech he made at the University of Sydney. I should repeat that Ramsey at the weekend said the comments were published in a Jewish newspaper and contained a reference to Jews as the underlying cause of all wars and that Jews who "used sex and abominable acts of buggery to control the world."

And this bloke, in spite of overtures that such a person shouldn't be kept in this country, has been kept here.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: And the reason he's been kept here is that the decisions the Labor Government took at that time gave him permanent residency and then citizenship, and once you achieve citizenship, it cannot be revoked. And you know, when we came into office…

ALAN JONES: So the deportation order of Hurford was revoked by Hurford's successor?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: That's right.

ALAN JONES: To placate an ethnic community in the run-up to the July '87 election?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: There were very significant pressures put on at that time, and former Prime Minister Keating, I believe, was the person who pushed for the Minister at that time to take those decisions.

ALAN JONES: Ramsey wrote on Saturday that privately the Sheik had travelled to Canberra for a meeting with McLeay and Keating and when Robert Ray learnt of it - the Minister - he deferred the Sheik's application for a year on the grounds of collusion. And Ramsey said that Keating wouldn't speak to Robert Ray for months.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, I know none of that. But I know that Ray was not keen to make the decision, but I know the decision was made and I know when I came Minister in 1996 it was a fait accompli.

I mean, citizenship is something that cannot be revoked unless it was initially obtained by fraud, and there is no suggestion here the information that you are speaking of was not known to the Government at the time.

ALAN JONES: Right. But Ramsey does say in September 1990, when Hand then approved Hilaly's permanent residence, you, Philip Ruddock, sought under Freedom of Information "all briefings and advisings" in the "grant of resident status to Hilaly and his family." And you were quoted as saying the Minister must be able to justify the decision, and yet you've never had those questions answered.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: No. I mean, you might - the question I would expect from you is why I haven't asked for those papers now and what would I do with it. And essentially I've come to the view that if I can't do anything about the decision, it's going to be pretty silly of me just seeking to look at the papers.

I mean, I know of the concerns. There were security concerns and they were mentioned in that article as well as the vilification of a segment of our community. And I make the point every time I speak in front of Hilaly about the importance of our culturally diverse society and what that means. And I make the point very strongly that, you know, when you've settled in Australia, while we acknowledge that people

have different cultural backgrounds, we have an expectation that they'll observe our laws.

And one of the things that disappoints me in relation to immigration laws is that some people seem to think - and Hilaly is arguing this - are entitled to ignore our laws if they relate to immigration. And I don't think you have a society that believes in the rule of law where you say, well, there are some laws that I'll obey and some that I won't.

ALAN JONES: But when a bloke says that the Prime Minister of a country has opened the gates to death because asylum seekers have drowned, isn't this an incitement to mobilise his people against those who support the Government?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Look, I mean it is very clear that remarks of that sort, if they were being made - and the sort of remarks that he's made elsewhere - would be matters that we would take into account under the character provisions if we were dealing with a migration application de nevo. They are matters…

ALAN JONES: He's already a permanent citizen.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: He's a permanent resident and citizen.

ALAN JONES: And citizen. But in January last year, is it right that he was sentenced to a year in jail with hard labour after being convicted of smuggling antiquities from Egypt to Australia?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: I believe there was a conviction which he has appealed and that appeal is still being dealt with.

ALAN JONES: And the Sheik's son and four other people were also jailed.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: I don't know about that, but I do know that those proceedings were taking place in Egypt and he was the subject of a conviction and that matter has been appealed and that appeal is still being dealt with.

ALAN JONES: It's not fair to the Muslim community, surely, to be represented in the public place by people who speak like this, is it?

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Well, I think the Islamic community have been very concerned about this matter themselves and he's been at times relieved of some of his responsibilities. And as I understand it, he is no longer the Mufti - which was the terms used - for the Supreme Spiritual Leader in Australia. He is just one of a number of imams.

ALAN JONES: Good on you. Thank you for your time because many of my listeners wrote and asked me to ask you those questions. I've done that and you've answered them. I thank you for that.

PHILIP RUDDOCK: Thanks, Alan.

ALAN JONES: Philip Ruddock, the Immigration Minister. There you are, we're inundated with letters and faxes and emails here about all of that. I hope that clarifies it for you. He is an Australian citizen.

29 October 2001

Make polygamy legal - sheik

news.com.au

June 24, 2008 12:00AM

Popular ... Sheikh Chami said he was asked almost weekly to conduct polygamous religious ceremonies.

MEMBERS of Australia's Islamic community believe polygamous marriages should be recognised to protect the rights of women.

Sheikh Khalil Chami of the Islamic Welfare Centre in Sydney's Lakemba today said polygamous marriages, although illegal, existed in Australia and should be recognised.

"... Not an open door but in a way everyone will have control," he told Triple J radio's Hack program.

"It's a bit hard, very difficult, but unless we face it, how (do) we overcome it?

"If you know there is law that will help you, there is community will help you. Why not? Why not change the law?"

Sheikh Chami said he was asked almost weekly to conduct polygamous religious ceremonies.

While he declined to perform such ceremonies, he said, other sheikhs did not.

"There are a lot of sheikhs here without any qualifications, without any place," he said.

"They'll conduct that marriage no problem at all."

Islamic Friendship Association of Australia president Keysar Trad said recognising polygamous unions would help protect the rights of women in the relationship.

Mr Trad once proposed to another woman with the consent of his wife, Hanefa, but the second marriage did not proceed.

"I certainly would not have entertained the thought of having a relationship without a religious marriage and I thought the relationship with that person was developing to the stage where we had become too friendly with each other," he told the program.

"Rather than entertain any thoughts of an affair I thought the only decent thing to do was to consider a proper commitment to that person.

"This idea of plural sexual relationships, it is not so much frowned upon by society as long as these people don't say we want a polygamous relationship."

Mr Trad's mother was a third wife in a polygamous relationship overseas and he said the women had admiration and respect for each other and supported each other.

"In a sense, it's a compliment to the original partner that if he didn't find marriage to be so good why would he go into it again," he said.

"In a sense, he's saying that his first wife has made life like heaven for him so he's willing to provide the same service, love and support to a second woman."

He said women were choosing to enter into such marriages.

Mrs Trad said many people in polygamous marriages kept it a secret - not only because it was illegal, but because society did not accept it.

"Tell you the truth, the hardest part of it (is) the way the others perceive it not what's happened between me and him," she said.

Asked if it was just about wanting sex with more women, she said: "Yeah it can be, but having it in the right way instead of having it in like go to prostitute or just date".

Read more of how Australian society is been tainted by Islamic Colonization, none other than the Multicultural Industries and media pin up boy Mr Trad, yes I know the article is ten years old but that's the point he's just the tip of the ice berg, multiply Trad and his "Islamic moral compass" by a hundred thousand fellow Islamist's and we have Sydney's Occupied Territories 2012. 

Islam's Man of a Million Comments